southerndownhill.com - Forum

I'm thinking of heading to UKBP either Saturday or Monday, and was wondering how the 4X course is holding up after the rain and NPS racing? Wet, rutted and worn - or still in good nick and worth a long drive?

Also, tyres - I guess on the soil there I'll be better on Highrollers than my super thin Larsen  TT? (The Larsens are a tad puncture prone, and I read about the sharp flint soil there...)

Thanks,

Seb

When we left sunday the bottom of the start hill was a mess and from the moguls down was wet and boggy but the rest was alright, just the layer of rocky stuff covered in a layer of slimey mud.

Sounds sketchy. Good course?

Not the best i've ridden, the guys have obviously put a LOT of effort in (props to them for actually doing it) but didn't seem to have a lot of flow and was a bit rough and ready.

Give it a year of riding in and some tweaking here and there and its got the potential to be a very good track.

all the talk about the course not following is correct but after being in Canada for the last two world cups this track is just like a world cup course,
OK its not going down a mountain but all the elements are the same.

Improvements can be made and no doubt will be as the guys at UK Bike park are really keen to have the best course in the country.

There will be some 4X races down there during the off the season, which i will take the start gate and help them run, so look out for the dates and come down for some good hard racing.

yeah I havent been up and its still going to be soggy as its rained pretty much all week
As for course changes there will be quite a few to try and make the racing tighter. as for flow, well its a hard one to call  and maybe flow isnt the right word??and most of the input we have had from the elites is that they dont want flow, it should be hard, nasty, difficult to ride and present the racing with lots of overtaking opportunities, we are not there yet however the design brief was to have a flowy start straight and then a nasty WC esque finish, so expect to see more WC type features and less flow in the second half of the course and more flow in the first straight , however one section that didnt work in the wet was the moguls which might change to a rhythmn section, maybe a rock garden ( very difficult to get right and not just turn into a one line option) we shall see

we welcome all the feedback we can get and aprreciate its not just a course for elite riders although BC feedback was very much of the view that we should make a hard track and not pander to the beginners with too many easy options( we dont neccesarily share this view!) so its a compromise between making a fun course with challenges for elites and also present the rider with loads of places for overtaking - we are not there yet ( and maybe never will please everyone!) .

 My personal view is that we will end up with an area that has courses that we cna use for NPS and other seperate add on sections that are fun on all types of bike ( dont forget its a bike park and we want to encourage mass participatiion) however rest assured all feedback is greatly accepted and we will do everything we can to help promote and grow 4x as a sport and hopefully help some more riders reach the top level in the sport.

keep watching this space and if anyone has any ideas please give me a ring
so far we are looking at the following ideas

1 corner on first straight - possible dog leg off to the right as an additional optional line
2 rhythmn section to replace moguls
3 course widening in places
4 new finish corners down the steep part of the hill, extending the track with more natural nasty stuff
5 wall rides on  first berm or possible inside berm
6 more mums cake !
7 less rain!

BTW I just re read that and it sounds as though I might be pandering to elite riders by providing a really hard course that beginners wont be able to ride - this wont be the case we want to develop all levels of riders but sometimes progression means that some sections might not be idela for beginners so this is where the multi line option comes in and we might have pro lines  akin to BMX tracks ( but far from smooth and huge jumps ie a pro line whcih is rough tough and looks nasty to even get down - How cool would a vigo rock section look!)

4x is for bmx drop outs who dont have the bulls to do it without suss.. crankworx and all that gash is for bmx street/park riders who arnt good enough to win comps so invented s**t shore jumps.. like bmx jumps slighlty down hill. for those glory hunters like bearclaw the huck king.. any top bmx rider would put these guys to shame!

dh/xc are the only pure forms of mtb-ing that arnt copies of bmx!

bmx is king when it come to racing and jumping! remember your roots and dont forget it!

anyway what i wanted to say was that ukbp is best on spikes.. cut downs so  for you four x boys thats a medusa exeption series and possibly a thinner dh wtescream for the front.. i only ride spikes there wet or dry.. my local track is the same ttyre and is always spikes.

so spikes i say

yeah torrico.. youu got it four cross tracks should be knarly and hard with line options.

alos spds should be banned.. f'ing skillless riders who need pedal power to win rather than the vodoo art of bike skills

There's nowt wrong with a tough, rough pro line. There should just be a smooth/easy line option that's longer as well. Chicken runs are pretty vital to encouraging participation at all levels. You're running some grassroots 4X stuff with a Novice class, so the track should definitely cater for that stuff - as well as offering the pros a challenge.

So the general view is it'll be wet this weekend then? Hmm, I was hoping to check it out and see whether I fancied doing the October race. Hmm...

moguls definately you should replace them with rhythms, they just dont work personally, extending it down the hill is an awesome idea, full on gnarly wc style, all the way to the bottom would be insane.

husky
great to see you voicing your opinions as strongly as ever !- keep up the good work- it makes a refreshing change on this forum
 
personally I think 4x is a great format for bike racing but we can agree to disagree

Flats should be banned, f'ing skill less riders who are so unsure of their bike skills, they need to be able to put their foot down at any moment  :P ;)

Having spent the weekend there for the NPS, on the whole, I feel it was more what a 4X track should be, as opposed to what they generally turn out like.

My views were the start straight was a little too long, with no gradient change. First corner was good, few incidents there. An inner (smaller berm) might promote more line choice in it.

Next short straight, good. Next corner was good, once people realised there was a line choice there, however I think if you bermed up the inside after the 3 little log steps it would become even more of a viable option. It would make the inside as quick as the outside. The big issue I saw there was people taking the outside line didn't have to brake & could carry more speed into the next straight. Berm up the inside so you can carry more speed onto the straight.

The moguls could work, if you got rid of the obvious line down the middle. It caused a bottleneck & stopped a few overtaking opportunities. Maybe rework them?

The last corner was interesting, until it got taped off on the Sunday. It seemed strange people seemed to all take the sheep line round the outside, even when it was tight, bar about 5 or 6 who nailed the inside line, missed the last sloppy berm & made up a place, if not 2!

Overall though, thumbs up from me, as you say, it could have a little tweak here & there, and you have to factor in things like the push up route, so you are limited to a certain extent by finish. It's definately an improvement on the likes of Chicksands IMO, especially when it was wet. It was commented on that a few people who have done well thus far on the 'groomed' tracks looked to be really struggling with the mud, the lines and testing second half.

Make it less about the gate/snap & more about the ability to actually ride something thats not a glorified BMX track on a hill & you won't go too far wrong in my book  :)

Downhill is all played now, its all to easy now with 8 inch travel bikes,
most of the courses you can ride on a hard tail, not much skill required for that.  :'(

Mmmn, after riding champery this summer i'd beg to differ.


On a serious note, the 4x racing looks quality its just slightly anoying that races will be held on saterdays. That means people who work in bike shops like meself are going to find it hard to compete (saterday is the hardest day to get off).

saterday? never heard of it

Nor capitals and full stops it would seem. "Let he who is with out sin... yadda yadda yadda".

More importantly, back to the proper topic. I'd agree with Foxo, it seems odd to have races on Saturdays. It's not just bike shop employees who work on Saturdays.

I didn't race the track, but came down on the Saturday to watch. Those who say it had no flow obviously didn't see any of the fast riders ripping it up. There was plenty of flow if you hit the down slopes of the jumps. For the bottom section, I wouldn't want to see another set of jumps where the moguls are. There are enough of them, surely? Maybe a rock garden or some smaller and more randomly placed moguls perhaps? I think the idea is good; just they ended up more like small jumps anyway.

I quite like the idea of saturday racing. It means I can spend Sunday curled up in front of the TV being lazy and licking my wounds from racing. I guess it makes it easier to run a full weekend of racing too (saturday 4x, sunday DH) and means you can race both if you wish.

iif it is going to be saturday it will be late afternoon/ evening, but more likely we will look at sunday racing

Or for when you rode BMX as a kid and now your joints cant take it without the sus!

In all honesty, aside from the huge amount of mud and my fear I was going to damage my ankle again I actually thought it was one of the best 4X tracks I'd raced on this summer.
It was nice to see something a bit different from the other tracks and once I'd got my bearings and stopped worrying about my ankle it actually became quite good fun riding it in the mud!
It seemed to be the only track this season that didn't solely depepend on the riders gate ability, plenty of options for overtaking, different lines (nice inside line on the 2nd berm worked well for me in 2 of my motos gaining me a 1st then a 2nd place after overtaking), just a bit more like a big open DH style track.
The moguls were interesting, not my favourite part of the course and I saw a lot of people just taking the central line and not really using different lines, a rock garden could be interesting there though!!

Re Torico's comment about the BC wanting a hard track and not pandering to beginners requirements, in all honesty this might not be such a bad thing.
There's easier courses out there, Chicksands for exaple, I love because it's flowy and easy to ride fast but having different styles of courses in the series makes it more interesting.
Some riders who are really fast on dry, hardpacked BMX style courses were really struggling last weekend which means that different people were getting higher places because they ride better on different courses, it just ups the game a little I think!

I look forward to more races over the winter to practice the track! ;D

Sketch!?

When you gonna ride at the park again? not see you for a while....!

Good thread this, been enjoying the input from everyone, word on the track .....still muddy! Looks like we are set for a dry spell so get up there and ride it!

To respond to some of the stuff so far....Saturday racing will be the format while we get started (We have to tie to other events for our volunteer manpower...the guys who run round and make it all happen!), after that we are looking at a 3 date winter series, just waiting to confirm dates, a gate and sponsors. Pleased the track was somthing different from the usual, it's not yet how we want it (long way to go!) but we didn't set out make a bowling green, we want it gnarly and messed up! This is moutain biking innit? "rough and ready!" I like it!!
We are talking to the FC about getting trees felled for an extension, until then we'll be looking to put in more over taking opportunities...don't expect it to get any easier...

You got it there! Practice and get dialled on this one, how are you going to find the others??  ;D


 

Hi Ali,
Been a bit bikeless for a bit, had to sell the Yeti to help fund becoming a home owner early in the year. Recently purchased a new hardtail (4x setup) so hopefully will be up there soon, just trying to remember how to ride.

I think it's nearly spot on 1 year since i was last up there.

(that must mean my membership needs renewing)

It's my local track though, it should naturally be my best, most ridden one really! ;)

you really are the most opinionated member of this forum aren't you